NDL Forum

Uuaww wrote:I have zero problem with pressing charges and the two players paying whatever penalty is given to them. That will be for the courts, etc. to decide. I have a problem with suspending a team and whatnot for the actions of the two unless there is other evidence that it was more than an independent action of the two players.

agree

Uuaww wrote: no it's the same as a kid assaulting another in a store. In a court of law, assault is assault regardless of where it is committed. location of said crime does not matter and a team forfeiting a season because of social media actions is stupid.

This is incorrect. If a player assaults someone inside of a football stadium, as part of a sanctioned event where he is representing the school, then the school and the administration can be held legally and financially responsible, especially if the person in question is a minor. If they beat up a kid in their neighborhood, then it has nothing at all to do with the team, you're right.

Again, you win as a team, you lose as a team. If the team wins the title, does Jimmy, the kid who never gets into the game, get a trophy? Yep. Should he be rewarded if he had nothing to do with the team's success on the field?

Sorry, but if two of your players assault a referee in a game, while two others have already been ejected for taunting, and other players are supporting the actions that were taken....there's a problem here.

Jsence, you're off your rocker my man.

jsence2 wrote:Again, you win as a team, you lose as a team. If the team wins the title, does Jimmy, the kid who never gets into the game, get a trophy? Yep. Should he be rewarded if he had nothing to do with the team's success on the field?

Does this only apply to sports?



If a player gets busted for steroids, should the whole team be suspended?

I'm trying to determine where you draw the line on the "win as a team/lose as a team" cliche.

This is for Ohio and for student injuries, but I assume Texas has a similar law.
Q: Our child was injured while playing soccer at school and we’ve got huge medical bills. Can we sue the school?
A: Parents sometimes bring legal actions against their child’s school, alleging that the school is engaging in negligence, recklessness or intentional wrongdoing by pushing children to compete too hard, failing to remove some dangerous condition present at the athletic facility, or allowing a dangerous player to participate in a school sports program. Recklessness and intentional wrongdoing by a school are difficult to prove and rarely exist in the context of school sports programs. Parents who decide to bring suit against a school frequently allege negligence, but the Ohio Legislature and the Supreme Court of Ohio have immunized individuals and entities involved with sports and similar recreational activities from liability for negligence. The Ohio law that governs immunity of a "political subdivision" such as a school district (including exceptions to that immunity) can be found in the Ohio Revised Code (Section 2744.02).


Basically says you can't sue schools and individuals involved with sports for negligence.

I wonder how the NCAA is gonna penalize Miami for the action of these two boys. Disgusting.

ajalves wrote:Jsence, you're off your rocker my man.

You're just now coming to this conclusion?

Uuaww wrote:This is for Ohio and for student injuries, but I assume Texas has a similar law.
Q: Our child was injured while playing soccer at school and we’ve got huge medical bills. Can we sue the school?
A: Parents sometimes bring legal actions against their child’s school, alleging that the school is engaging in negligence, recklessness or intentional wrongdoing by pushing children to compete too hard, failing to remove some dangerous condition present at the athletic facility, or allowing a dangerous player to participate in a school sports program. Recklessness and intentional wrongdoing by a school are difficult to prove and rarely exist in the context of school sports programs. Parents who decide to bring suit against a school frequently allege negligence, but the Ohio Legislature and the Supreme Court of Ohio have immunized individuals and entities involved with sports and similar recreational activities from liability for negligence. The Ohio law that governs immunity of a "political subdivision" such as a school district (including exceptions to that immunity) can be found in the Ohio Revised Code (Section 2744.02).


Basically says you can't sue schools and individuals involved with sports for negligence.

I was going to comment on this as well. Individuals that commit a crime on school property does not put the school or its administration in jeopardy of anything, unless they themselves were part of the crime. This had nothing to do with the district or administration.

I like when Jason goes off on moral and ethical rants. It makes for some interesting reading and side comedy.

To me it is obvious, the 2 boys are suspended and are not allowed to play high school sports again. Coach and players are investigated to find out the root cause of the situation. Ref crew is investigated and if said ref did escalate this situation with racial slurs his reffing certificate is pulled and is banned from reffing organized sports. If coach is found to have had knowledge of the plan, or assistants had knowledge they themselves would be added into the conspiracy to injure and they get similar punishments. Only then will you really be able to determine the team punishment if there is one required. I find it hard to believe that the coaches would have been a part of the scheme, but stranger things have happened.

Coug playing the role of the voice of reason. I like it.

I'm not always an ahole...

I am surprised that shel didn't turn this into a "bounty-gate" argument

ajalves wrote:Jsence, you're off your rocker my man.

Then I guess so are most sports talk show hosts, referees, referee associations, etc.

Btw Autiger, the day still hasn't come where I care what you think of me. But kudos to you for your dedication, it might pay off someday, you never know. Unlikely, but keep chasing your dreams

jsence2 wrote:

ajalves wrote:Jsence, you're off your rocker my man.

Then I guess so are most sports talk show hosts, referees, referee associations, etc.

There it is!!!

You're saying most sports talk show hosts are calling for the team forfeit the season without any investigation needed? Just wanna make sure I understand your side and what these sports show hosts are saying.

I'd be very surprised to here most sports talk show hosts are calling for hasty decisions without determining the facts first.

Just think about it for one second, about 7 or 8 guys have responded, basically saying, let's just find out the facts first. What's so wrong with that?

shel311 wrote:

jsence2 wrote:Again, you win as a team, you lose as a team. If the team wins the title, does Jimmy, the kid who never gets into the game, get a trophy? Yep. Should he be rewarded if he had nothing to do with the team's success on the field?

Does this only apply to sports?



If a player gets busted for steroids, should the whole team be suspended?

I'm trying to determine where you draw the line on the "win as a team/lose as a team" cliche.

Player ruled ineligible, entire team suffers
Player isn't eligible due to age/size, team ruled ineligible, wins stripped, entire team suffers

Two players ASSAULT a referee who had no way to protect himself and could have died if things had gone differently, and you want to argue semantics rather than see that there's a serious problem here with the "blame referees/attack referees" culture that has permiated youth sports. Remember all those stories we see about parents fighting refs and attacking refs? Well, this is what it has led to: kids thinking it's ok to do the same. Do you think any referee is going to want to officiate a game for this team this year? Do you think it's ok for multiple players on the team to tweet out supporting the two guys who attacked the referee? If so, then continue to debate semantics so you can once again claim that you are the winner of a stupid argument. In the meantime, I'm going to listen to the people who actually have a lot more knowledge and insight into this (former and current coaches, referees, etc) than you or I.

Uuaww wrote:This is for Ohio and for student injuries, but I assume Texas has a similar law.
Q: Our child was injured while playing soccer at school and we’ve got huge medical bills. Can we sue the school?
A: Parents sometimes bring legal actions against their child’s school, alleging that the school is engaging in negligence, recklessness or intentional wrongdoing by pushing children to compete too hard, failing to remove some dangerous condition present at the athletic facility, or allowing a dangerous player to participate in a school sports program. Recklessness and intentional wrongdoing by a school are difficult to prove and rarely exist in the context of school sports programs. Parents who decide to bring suit against a school frequently allege negligence, but the Ohio Legislature and the Supreme Court of Ohio have immunized individuals and entities involved with sports and similar recreational activities from liability for negligence. The Ohio law that governs immunity of a "political subdivision" such as a school district (including exceptions to that immunity) can be found in the Ohio Revised Code (Section 2744.02).


Basically says you can't sue schools and individuals involved with sports for negligence.

Student injuries =\= assault on a referee

Students and their families sign a liability waiver to play sports.

just got stung by a bee for the 2nd time in 4 days. I'd only ever been stung once before in my life. so fucking annoying.

jsence2 wrote:

Uuaww wrote:This is for Ohio and for student injuries, but I assume Texas has a similar law.
Q: Our child was injured while playing soccer at school and we’ve got huge medical bills. Can we sue the school?
A: Parents sometimes bring legal actions against their child’s school, alleging that the school is engaging in negligence, recklessness or intentional wrongdoing by pushing children to compete too hard, failing to remove some dangerous condition present at the athletic facility, or allowing a dangerous player to participate in a school sports program. Recklessness and intentional wrongdoing by a school are difficult to prove and rarely exist in the context of school sports programs. Parents who decide to bring suit against a school frequently allege negligence, but the Ohio Legislature and the Supreme Court of Ohio have immunized individuals and entities involved with sports and similar recreational activities from liability for negligence. The Ohio law that governs immunity of a "political subdivision" such as a school district (including exceptions to that immunity) can be found in the Ohio Revised Code (Section 2744.02).


Basically says you can't sue schools and individuals involved with sports for negligence.

Student injuries =\= assault on a referee

Students and their families sign a liability waiver to play sports.

Don't know where you are going with this.

Students and their parents don't sign a waiver to commit a crime, so the admin and school district are still not liable for any of this.

jsence2 wrote:

shel311 wrote:

jsence2 wrote:Again, you win as a team, you lose as a team. If the team wins the title, does Jimmy, the kid who never gets into the game, get a trophy? Yep. Should he be rewarded if he had nothing to do with the team's success on the field?

Does this only apply to sports?



If a player gets busted for steroids, should the whole team be suspended?

I'm trying to determine where you draw the line on the "win as a team/lose as a team" cliche.

Player ruled ineligible, entire team suffers
Player isn't eligible due to age/size, team ruled ineligible, wins stripped, entire team suffers

Two players ASSAULT a referee who had no way to protect himself and could have died if things had gone differently, and you want to argue semantics rather than see that there's a serious problem here with the "blame referees/attack referees" culture that has permiated youth sports. Remember all those stories we see about parents fighting refs and attacking refs? Well, this is what it has led to: kids thinking it's ok to do the same. Do you think any referee is going to want to officiate a game for this team this year? Do you think it's ok for multiple players on the team to tweet out supporting the two guys who attacked the referee? If so, then continue to debate semantics so you can once again claim that you are the winner of a stupid argument. In the meantime, I'm going to listen to the people who actually have a lot more knowledge and insight into this (former and current coaches, referees, etc) than you or I.

Nope, just wanted an answer to the specific question, where you'd draw the line, is it sport only or in a work environment as well?

Also, the people who have more knowledge than us don't want an investigation conducted before making determinations? I find that hard to believe that's the overwhelming concensus.

jsence2 wrote:
Student injuries =\= assault on a referee

Students and their families sign a liability waiver to play sports.

You could go to the OOTP thread and make your pick or say to be skipped, just saying

But you've been skipped officially now

nick wrote:just got stung by a bee for the 2nd time in 4 days. I'd only ever been stung once before in my life. so fucking annoying.

I cannot remember the last time I got stung by anything, used to happen all the time as a kid