Politics and stuff

[shel311]

they left him dead on the street for 12 hours too.. keep defending the pigs tho.

Move those goalposts nick, move em!!!



It IS funny you say that while I never did anything remotely of the sort and you're literally defending shooting cops

[GeorgesGoons]

1 also shot in Vegas and 1 involved in a hit and run.

But half the country will call you racist if you condemn the violent protests.


Good times!!!

you know cops killed a black protester in Louisville right? Get this.. the man was known for giving cops free food and was peaceful and they shot him in the back.

Dead Black People - 2
Dead Cops - 0

#BlueLivesMatterrrr BlueLivesMatterrrrr

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/01/us/louis ... index.html

I wouldn't call it 2. 1 of them was from over 2 months ago during a no-knock narcotics search warrant. 3 officers went in to conduct the search warrant and were fired upon, they returned fire and she was killed.

And you also forgot to mention that the cops and national guard were being shot at in the David McAtae shooting. Both cops and national guard returned fire. They haven't determined if McAtae was involved int he shooting.

Just wanted to put out all the facts out there since you make it sound as if it was cold blooded murder.

[Crowes]

1 also shot in Vegas and 1 involved in a hit and run.

But half the country will call you racist if you condemn the violent protests.


Good times!!!

you know cops killed a black protester in Louisville right? Get this.. the man was known for giving cops free food and was peaceful and they shot him in the back.

Dead Black People - 2
Dead Cops - 0

#BlueLivesMatterrrr BlueLivesMatterrrrr

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/01/us/louis ... index.html

I wouldn't call it 2. 1 of them was from over 2 months ago during a no-knock narcotics search warrant. 3 officers went in to conduct the search warrant and were fired upon, they returned fire and she was killed.

And you also forgot to mention that the cops and national guard were being shot at in the David McAtae shooting. Both cops and national guard returned fire. They haven't determined if McAtae was involved int he shooting.

Just wanted to put out all the facts out there since you make it sound as if it was cold blooded murder.

You left out a couple significant details that the police went to the wrong address and had the suspect the warrant was for already in police custody at the time of them doing that no knock warrant and killing that woman.

[GeorgesGoons]

1 also shot in Vegas and 1 involved in a hit and run.

But half the country will call you racist if you condemn the violent protests.


Good times!!!

you know cops killed a black protester in Louisville right? Get this.. the man was known for giving cops free food and was peaceful and they shot him in the back.

Dead Black People - 2
Dead Cops - 0

#BlueLivesMatterrrr BlueLivesMatterrrrr

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/01/us/louis ... index.html

I wouldn't call it 2. 1 of them was from over 2 months ago during a no-knock narcotics search warrant. 3 officers went in to conduct the search warrant and were fired upon, they returned fire and she was killed.

And you also forgot to mention that the cops and national guard were being shot at in the David McAtae shooting. Both cops and national guard returned fire. They haven't determined if McAtae was involved int he shooting.

Just wanted to put out all the facts out there since you make it sound as if it was cold blooded murder.

You left out a couple significant details that the police went to the wrong address and had the suspect the warrant was for already in police custody at the time of them doing that no knock warrant and killing that woman.

I just skimmed the article. Does make a huge difference

[Crowes]

Yeah the man that fired on the police thought someone was breaking into his home. He was initially arrested and charged with attempted murder for shooting at the cops but he was eventually released after the story received national attention.

[nick]

Minnesota officials have identified white nationalist groups operating on the ground amid the protests in Minneapolis and St. Paul over the police killing of George Floyd, the state's Department of Corrections said late Sunday.

[shel311]

Looters in a town near Philadelphia have cleaned out all 7 stores in a chain that is basically the only local way for people to get groceries. The store is unable to reopen now or anytime soon obviously. Many usually take the bus and now can't afford to go out further to get their groceries.

But yay for supporting looting and rioting that is only serving to hurt the communities and people you're supposed to be fighting for?

[shel311]

If you go to Twitter and search "racist" under People, you get a bunch of twitter handles with the word "Racist" in them.

But the very first person at the top of the search is...Donald Trump's verified account.


Twitter is just trolling the F out of Trump right now. I can't say the stuff they've been doing to him is right, but it's funny as hell.

[GeorgesGoons]

If you go to Twitter and search "racist" under People, you get a bunch of twitter handles with the word "Racist" in them.

But the very first person at the top of the search is...Donald Trump's verified account.


Twitter is just trolling the F out of Trump right now. I can't say the stuff they've been doing to him is right, but it's funny as hell.

Until he hits them with a defamation of character lawsuit. I would not put that past him

[nick]

fun little math moment.. simple grade 2 math for me.

i see the "well cops kill more white people" argument over and over

Cop Killings (By Color) - 2019
Whites - 370
Blacks - 235

omg thats so crazy there's more white people killed.. why is it BLM?

Population by color in the US: 2019
Whites - 197 Million
Blacks - 42 million

so there is 4.5x more white people than black people in the US of A

so when you do the division

White People = 370 / 197 Mil = 0.000188%
Black People = 235 / 42 Mil = 0.00056%

so youre 3x more likely to be killed if youre black than if youre white.

so next time someone brings up that "oh well..." or "bbbbut" response, just show them this image.

[shel311]

Population isn't as relevant as who is being stopped by cops and for what reason.

Studies show the most common correlation between being shot by cops is violent crime rates. In counties where most white people commit violent crimes, more white people are killed by cops. Same in reverse for black people.

When you adjust for the most common correlation in violent crimes, the numbers are pretty close,as they should be but I think it was like 4 out of 10k white people vs 3 out of 10k black people killed based on violent crime rates.

Basically every study I've ever read shows no correlation in race when it comes to police shootings. But there are correlations that show black people seem to be harassed more by cops, studies do tend to show that.


Another side point, when a black person is killed by cops, there is also no correlation of the race of the cop who killed the black person. So even if black people were killed in droves more than white people(they're not) by cops, the issue and protesting should be black people vs cops, and not what it 100% is today, black people vs white people.

[shel311]

Also, hat tip to the grade 2 math line, well played!

[GeorgesGoons]

Also, hat tip to the grade 2 math line, well played!

[GeorgesGoons]

Population isn't as relevant as who is being stopped by cops and for what reason.

Studies show the most common correlation between being shot by cops is violent crime rates. In counties where most white people commit violent crimes, more white people are killed by cops. Same in reverse for black people.

When you adjust for the most common correlation in violent crimes, the numbers are pretty close,as they should be but I think it was like 4 out of 10k white people vs 3 out of 10k black people killed based on violent crime rates.

100% this, glad you found the information and I didn't have to.

[ReignOnU]

It's a massive rabbit hole if you ever want to jump into it... here's just a sample of stuff...

- More white people are killed by officers per year than black
- Black people are 2.5x-3x more likely to be killed based on % of population
- White people are ~1.2x more likely to be killed based on % of violent offenses
- The strongest correlation to police killings is neither race or violent offenses... it is income
- # of deaths per year seem to jump randomly, but have been large downward trend since August of 2015
- Likelihood of being killed by an officer has decreased over most 10yr ranges that you can select (there are instances of spike years that skew this one)
- Since 1996, the # of violent offenses has decreased significantly
- Most unarmed stats by year are pretty close to the killing stats
- Recent years have more "unknown" races than prior years. These unknowns tend to fall between white/Hispanic and white/Asian.

These are some of the common arguments... but wait, there's more!

- Chicken or egg? Blacks commit more violent crimes, but studies show that they are more harshly charged. This skews tons of the above data.
- What about officer aggression? On a day-to-day basis, is an officer in an urban environment going to more aggressive than an officer in a rural/suburban environment? Should they be?
- Why do officers kill? Racist? Power hungry ego-maniac? Fear? Built up aggression? Poor training?

Here's the 1 thing that I think everyone can agree on... we need more accountability from our PDs. Between 2005 and 2017, only 80 were brought up on charges. Less than 30 were convicted as of 2018.

My thoughts on it... we do have a police brutality issue. We do have an issue with blacks being targeted within that. But to me, it's silly to address just part of it, when we can reform the system and tighten the accountability on all officers, under all situations.

https://www.sunherald.com/news/nation-w ... 97771.html
This is NOT OK either! Fix it ALL!

...of course, don't get me started on this take on the same incident:
Tough love or excessive force?

[ReignOnU]

Speaking of rabbit holes... I was going to include this in the other post, but it has a lot of specific info it and detracts from the above...

- Here's an angle you likely haven't discussed or heard people discuss... did we have a hand in making this problem? Our expectations of an officer are of a nobleman (or woman), with the high level physical training and strong mental aptitude.

We pay our entry level officers in rural/suburban areas ~$35k. Many of them need to supplement their income by working 2nd jobs as security/transport. Those in a major force will get above $60k and push to $80k or so with a few years of service. Chauvin, for instance, was all the way up to $90k. But the average salary for their PD was about $42k. It's a little skewed, as MPD is one of the highest paying for his grade in the country. Chauvin was a long-time officer, but as we found out, he had worked for over 15yrs supplementing his income at a club (like many others).

In 2008, we had 708k police officers. In 2015, we had 636k. That's a huge reduction. Since then, we've been growing about 10k per year. As a few of you may know, I've given quite a few aptitude and promotional exams for officers (over 10k now). I can tell you first hand that the top 10% of those applicants are far different than what you'd expect. (This includes rural forces in northern Kentucky, through Cincinnati PD, Dayton PD and the MCSO (Dayton area Sheriff's office).

Why did we have the reduction in officers? What strains did that put on the officers that remained? With the huge reduction and current growth, what is the quality of the average candidate?

What you find when you really dig through it is kind of an old adage... you get what you pay for.

[GeorgesGoons]

- The strongest correlation to police killings is neither race or violent offenses... it is income

This is 100% truth!

I'd also throw in that the heightened "spidey senses" (for a lack of a better word/phrase) when working in those low income areas has to take a tole on you mentally and physically. To be on alert 100% of the time will run a man/woman down. I don't think officers in rural areas have to be on heightened alert at all times compared to the southside of Chicago.

[Crowes]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -heres-why

Interesting article I think. Has some points that make sense about what we as a country has forced "police work" to morph into.

Over the last 40 years we have seen a massive expansion of the scope and intensity of policing. Every social problem in poor and non-white communities has been turned over to the police to manage. The schools don’t work; let’s create school policing. Mental health services are decimated; let’s send police. Overdoses are epidemic; let’s criminalize people who share drugs. Young people are caught in a cycle of violence and despair; let’s call them superpredators and put them in prison for life.

Police have also become more militarized. The Federal 1033 program, the Department of Justice’s “Cops Office,” and homeland security grants have channeled billions of dollars in military hardware into American police departments to advance their “war on crime” mentality. A whole generation of police officers have been given “warrior” training that teaches them to see every encounter with the public as potentially their last, leading to a hostile attitude towards those policed and the unnecessary killing of people falsely considered a threat, such as the 12-year-old Tamir Rice, killed for holding a toy gun in an Ohio park.


The alternative is not more money for police training programs, hardware or oversight. It is to dramatically shrink their function. We must demand that local politicians develop non-police solutions to the problems poor people face. We must invest in housing, employment and healthcare in ways that directly target the problems of public safety. Instead of criminalizing homelessness, we need publicly financed supportive housing; instead of gang units, we need community-based anti-violence programs, trauma services and jobs for young people; instead of school police we need more counselors, after-school programs, and restorative justice programs

[shel311]

77-year-old retired police captain David Dorn, who served 38 years with the St. Louis P.D., was shot and killed while protecting a friend’s pawn shop from looters.

[shel311]

This dude actually saying show me where it says protests are supposed to be peaceful...that has to be one of those George-like trolls where you pretend you're dumb and don't know any better, right?

https://mobile.twitter.com/SteveGuest/s ... 5198585856